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Post by dirtracer on Feb 19, 2009 14:18:10 GMT -5
New guy to this board. Looks like there is a wealth of knowledge to learn from here. I was wondering if any of you have experience with gasoline octane testing devices? A track we go to tests fuel randomly. I was curious to know what kind of reading might result from a test sample of E85 with no other additives in it. Unfortunately I do not know the exact brand/model of gasoline tester this is, other than it supposedly cost close to $10,000 new. All I do know is that the samples have to be pumped into these short glass jars with screw on metal lids that were provoded from the manufacturer of said device.
I have done a little bit of looking around to see how some of the higher quality portable testing devices worked, and it didn't seem to give an idea of the change that ethanol/methanol made to the samples. I'm not really looking to find what the exact octane of a given sample is, more to whether a gasoline octane tester would read the actual octane of pump E85, or some other number since it such a large percentage of ethanol.
Any insight you have is helpful.
Thanks,
Mark
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Post by adamsvega on Feb 19, 2009 18:00:49 GMT -5
why test octane?? the ron and mon test engines and such are too much . most tracks that need to ck fuel ck specific gravity and dye color . if it matches what you are legal for ya pass. note some itchy types with chemistry exp. can whip up a good mix that will pass tech ,hydro and spec. gravity and be alittle better in the power output but thats cheatin!!!
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Post by dirtracer on Feb 19, 2009 22:51:07 GMT -5
Well, the class we are involved in specifies "pump gas only 94 octane max, on the track testing device" so the gasoline octane test has a legit purpose. Due to the fact that they do not sell a quality, legal gas at the track, they cannot compare to a reference sample. There is none. Some people from out of state can get 94 with no ethanol blended. In our state 93 with a random ethanol blend up to 10% is the norm. Some guys use 93 with a "little something" added from the chemical supplier, to give an extra cushion before detonation.
One of the engine combinations that many of us(myself) are stuck with is a touch over the edge of demanding a higher octane gas. Due to some rule changes, detuning them this year will really put us behind for power. Really just looking to see how far we can go while not failing the fuel test.
Remember, its just "working in the grey area" if the fuel passes the test.
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Post by adamsvega on Feb 19, 2009 23:13:29 GMT -5
if all they check is octane and nothing else which method of test is it rom ,mon, or r+m/2  the oxy content in alky will give ya more power per pound of fuel .at 94 max octane you could mix some up yourself . and run it richer to compensate the lean up from its addition. it is just math and jets. can you use leaded? pm me your combo and the rules and i can see what i come up with .i have a big dyno sym and cam profile program that will get er done . |
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Post by adamsvega on Feb 19, 2009 23:16:27 GMT -5
go to vp fuels and look at there unleaded and leaded fuels they are adding ethanol to there fuels to oxygenate for more power for a given octane or allowing high comp and boost due to the evaporative cooling of the intake charge due to alky . i build claimer motors and have been asked to make 12-1 motors recently ----hummmmmmm
do ya think they live on pump gas*
one guy* mixed nitropropane, methanol polyproplene oxide and acetone to 87 octane fuel and some blue green washer solvent dye. it passed tech after two race wins they bought his engine for 500$$ and he laughed as they ran it to last place and blew it up . he was canadian so i can talk !!!
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Post by dirtracer on Feb 20, 2009 11:03:38 GMT -5
I think the tester is a Zeltex ZX101C. www.zeltex.com It is the only one I found online that uses the sample container I mentioned, and seems to cost around the price they claim they paid for it. I would assume it gives the officials a reading in R+M/2, because that would correspond with the numbers on the pump gas. Unleaded only is specified in the rules as well. I love your last post. A fine bit of creativity there!! I don't have a problem with experimenting on the car and putting the time into tuning. I would just like to get an idea if this tester would be able to give an actual octane reading of a sample if it was in the range of 50 to 85% ethanol. I think it would be fantastic if they just let us, or made us run E85, instead of having to jerk around with fuel and not get caught. The alternative is take out compression and timing or buy a new engine. |
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Post by adamsvega on Feb 20, 2009 18:11:43 GMT -5
it says it is calbrated for ethanol blended and unleaded fuels and reads in pump octane .
i would call them or e-mail them and ask if the unit needs to be switched to cheak ethonol blends . tell them you have pump gas from 0 to 20 % ethanol and ya need to know if it will throw it off if not set up properly .... and what would happen if leaded or other additives will throw it off .
i wish i had access to that tool for about 15 min.s to test some . can ya submit samples to test prior to season start!! ask em to test some samples cause ya want to dyno your combo and you need to use the "spec fuel ..if ya cant get the data from the tester people then ask how much to run some samples ya mix up
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